Voiceover (00:01):
Welcome to On The AGenda, Steptoe's guide to state attorneys general and other enforcement regulation and compliance matters. From AI to smokestacks, consumer protection to financial services, data privacy to antitrust. Join Steptoe's seasoned litigators, counselors, and advisors as they deliver the critical insights and industry knowledge that government officials respect and that companies, nonprofits, and executives can use to navigate whatever legal challenges they face.
Michelle Kallen (00:31):
Hello and welcome to On The AGenda Steptoe's podcast focused on State Attorneys General. I am Michelle Kallen. I'm a partner in Steptoe's government and regulatory litigation practice, as well as co-chair of our appeals and advocacy practice. Before joining Steptoe, I served as Solicitor General in Virginia, and I am joined today by my colleague, Weisiyu Jiang. Weisiyu, I'll turn it over to you.
Weisiyu Jiang (00:53):
Thank you. I'm Weisiyu, an associate of Steptoe focusing on antitrust and regulatory compliance. We're very excited to welcome Virginia Attorney General Jay Jones to the podcast today. General Jones has an extensive background in public service. He previously served in the Virginia House of Delegates and as an assistant attorney general in Washington DC before being elected to his current role. General Jones, thank you so much for joining us.
AG Jay Jones (01:15):
Thank you for having me. I'm happy to see you both and chat with you for a little bit. Thank you for doing this. It's an amazing thing.
Michelle Kallen (01:22):
Well, we're absolutely thrilled to have you on. And as a Virginia AGO alum, I'm particularly excited to have you here with us. So to start us off, your office took a strong set of day one actions. Can you tell our audience, how did your prior public service experience shape the view that you brought with you to the AG's office?
AG Jay Jones (01:43):
Well, let me start by just saying that it is an honor to be the 49th Attorney General for the Commonwealth of Virginia. It is an awesome job with a significant amount of responsibility and the ability to impact people from corner to corner in Virginia. And I would put this job up against any other one in the state in terms of depth and breadth. And so for me, it was really informed by my time in the House of Delegates where I was a member for four years, one of 100, and then one of 140 total in the General Assembly, where I worked closely with folks in the AG's office to, I think, improve people's lives here in Virginia, but became very interested in the idea that this office can shape people's lives every single day without legislative involvement. And then I had the most wonderful opportunity to serve as an assistant attorney general in the District of Columbia under then AG Karl Racine, who gave me an opportunity to learn as an attorney, to grow, to really dive into consumer protection, which is where I focused as a member of the OCP in that office.
(02:44):
And so to see it work in that office, I was really excited about the opportunity to try to do that in Virginia. We were charged in DC with the mission to go find bad things and right wrongs, and I really have tried to do that here in Virginia. And as we prepared to take office over the course of November and December and into January, we were committed to delivering on the promises that we talked about over the course of the campaign, which was really focused on preventing federal overreach, putting money back in people's pockets, and keeping Virginia safe. And I think those three things have informed our time in office, which is nearing 100 days. And I'm proud to say that I think that we've done a great job delivering on those three tenants. We have obviously been very litigious with the federal government because I believe that those actions have had adverse impacts to people here in this Commonwealth.
(03:33):
And so we have joined numerous suits, initiated suits, sent letters to the federal government, you name it, all in the name of making sure that Virginia is not shortchanged and that we are not on a bad foot because of some of these policies. We have worked really hard to make sure that we are prioritizing people's needs in this moment, especially as it relates to their finances. Something that I heard over and over and over again last year was that people talked about life being very expensive. And I could empathize because I have two young children. My older son, Charles, is almost four. My younger son Zachary is almost two, and they are hungry little children. They eat berries and eat eggs and drink milk just like everybody else. And we as a family can measure the rising costs for those products in particular. And so I'm not just working for other people in Virginia whenever trying to tackle affordability, I'm working for myself as well.
(04:19):
And then obviously keeping communities safe. As the son of a violent crime prosecutor, I grew up in courtrooms watching my mother tackle the most difficult cases in our communities. And so I've long respected law enforcement and the work that they do to keep us safe. And I'm proud of the partnerships that my office has with state and local law enforcement across the Commonwealth to make sure that we're delivering on those promises to deliver safe communities for people. And it's really been, I think, a real highlight. We have been in office now for almost three months, and to be able to do this work and to do it well is something that I'm incredibly proud of, not just for me, but for my team and for everybody here at OAG, because I think people look to this office for protection in a whole host of ways.
(05:00):
And that, again, has been a priority of ours since the moment we took office back in January.
Weisiyu Jiang (05:04):
And General, I think you had quite the first few months, historical inauguration, a wave of day one actions and a new office structure. Before we get into the substance, I'm wondering if there's anything that has surprised you the most since you took office in January, either about the road itself or the challenges facing Virginia today?
AG Jay Jones (05:23):
Well, the challenges I certainly heard about over the course of the campaign and attuned to what's happening across the Commonwealth. I have the good fortune of being able to travel a lot to make sure that I am listening to people here in Virginia. I think one of the things that we as statewide officials continue to do and should do is go meet people where they are. We are fortunate to have several offices across Virginia to avail ourselves of these communities, but I try to be as frequent a flyer as I can to Southside, to the Shenandoah Valley, to Southwest Virginia, because I want them to know that although I'm a Democrat, I represent every single person here in Virginia, and I want to do it to the best of my ability. And my team knows that because a lot of the issues that people are facing are not partisan.
(06:03):
Everybody is being impacted by a rising cost. Everybody is impacted by crime in their communities. And so that is sort of a thread that unites us. And I think if we can keep sight of that, we'll have a lot of success, and that's really what I've been focused on. But from a more broad perspective, I've been really surprised, surprised maybe not the right word, but I've been really heartened by the amount of bipartisan cooperation amongst attorneys general offices across the country. We do so many things with offices from the other side of the aisle that I believe, again, are nonpartisan that are really common sense to try to deliver results for our constituents and the people in our respective states. And I will give the National Association of Attorneys General NAAG a shout-out because they continue to bring us all together to find ways for us to work together to leverage the resources of particular offices and the expertise that certain offices may have.
(06:52):
And I got to see this through a different lens as an assistant attorney general where one of the things that I was responsible for, and this is not the most exciting of topics, but was robocalls. And we had a 50-state program to try to eliminate robocalls to the best of our ability. And that was something that really does bridge the partisan divide because I don't care if you're liberal, conservative, Democrat, Republican, independent, moderate or anything in between, none of us like getting those calls on our cell phones at all hours of the day, offering us a car loan or trying to help us refinance something that doesn't exist. And so that is just one of the many ways that we all do work together. I'm also really proud of the result that we achieved in a matter just a couple of weeks ago with Live Nation.
(07:31):
A group of bipartisan attorneys general achieved a landmark decision against Live Nation, which I think took a lot of work and a lot of courage on behalf of a lot of offices. And so that's one of many situations where we're all working together, moving in the same direction because we all care about our people and everyone has a stake in that outcome.
Weisiyu Jiang (07:50):
General, I'm glad you mentioned Live Nation. And in terms of the antitrust area, we've seen several state AGs recently, including, for example, Colorado AG, Phil Weiser, and California AG Rob Bonta. They have commented that states should be playing a more prominent role in antitrust enforcement now because the federal government has sort of retreated from its traditional role in enforcing antitrust laws, which has created a void that enables corporate consolidations and price hacks. Do you agree with them on this? And what do you think Virginia's role should be in terms of trust enforcement at this current moment?
AG Jay Jones (08:24):
I absolutely agree. And I will tell you that Phil Weiser is an expert in antitrust. And so when he is talking about this area, I'm listening. And I will say that Rob and his office have been a real leader as well as Tish James in New York. They were the lead litigators on the Live Nation matter and delivered an outstanding result, which is going to have ramifications across the country, even for the states that did not participate. It's going to drive down costs for folks who are just trying to get a night or a two of entertainment in their community. And so we have seen an expansion of antitrust actions by Attorneys General, and that's something that I observed even just a few years ago when I was in the private sector doing Attorneys General work because it is such an open area and especially when the federal government is not participating or they are abdicating their responsibility or take a different viewpoint on the outcome or the issue at hand.
(09:15):
And so I do think you're seeing AG offices across the country build up or build out their antitrust practices, which I think is a good thing. Again, for me, my background is in consumer protection. And so I view this as an extension of consumer protection. And for us, our antitrust group also sits in the same division as consumer protection. And so they are often working together to try to find and achieve the best outcomes for our people here in Virginia. And it's one of the reasons why we created the public advocacy division here in Virginia to make sure that we're leveraging some of these commonalities and making sure that attorneys who are doing similar things or have certain expertise can get good outcomes for our residents here by working together and working collaboratively. But I do think that this is the next frontier for AGs here in the United States.
(10:00):
And I would not be surprised if you see more offices getting involved and I'd say more aggressive actions. But again, even just talking about Live Nation, because it's fresh in our minds from a couple of weeks ago, you saw states like Tennessee, you saw states like Utah, you saw states like New Hampshire get very involved in this matter because it's something that will set a precedent for generations to come and it's going to have benefits for folks all across the country. So to be able to stand shoulder to shoulder with those offices, again, of different political parties, I think really does send a message that bipartisanship is alive and well. But when we put people first, there are a lot of things that bring us together and a lot of things that we can work together on to find common ground.
Michelle Kallen (10:38):
You mentioned the Public Advocacy Division. Can you share a little bit more about your vision for the division, how it's kind of working, building it out within OAG's infrastructure and your vision for the Public Advocacy Division moving forward?
AG Jay Jones (10:51):
Absolutely. And as an alum of the OAG, you know these groups that we've put together pretty well, Michelle. But for those who don't know in Virginia, we have obviously several different divisions in our office, but I took this idea from the DCAG's office, and I guess there is that phrase that good writers borrow, great writers steal. And I stole this idea from DC because I was a member of the Public Advocacy Division there and saw the benefits that we were able to provide to people, not just in DC, but across the region and across the country. And so I wanted to emulate that because I think it's important for Virginians to have attorneys in an affirmative way working together to move in the right direction and on the same direction. And so one of our day one actions was to create the Public Advocacy Division.
(11:34):
And I'm really excited because our deputy for Public Advocacy, Helen Hardiman, is not only a veteran of this office under AG Mark Herring, but a veteran of the Biden administration doing housing. So PAD, as we affectionately call it, contains housing, civil rights, voting rights, insurance and utilities, and the things that I think are really nitty-gritty and the things that are most effective in protecting people in Virginia. Consumer protection is in there as well. And so we've put together 70 attorneys in that division who are really cranking it out in a good way for folks here in the Commonwealth. And to me, it is a more efficient way to set up the office. And I hope it will be something that stands here for a long time and is part of my legacy as the 49th Attorney General of Virginia. But I've been so proud of the work that they've been doing and the results that we've achieved in such a short time.
(12:22):
But to see these folks collaborating together where the left hand knows what the right hand is doing, not only great for our office in particular, but it's good for the people of Virginia. We have really focused in on delivering the best work and the best client service that we can while also making sure that we are living up to our values and to our ideals. Michelle, you came to work in the Barbara Johns building here in Richmond. And for those folks who have never been, I invite you in, it's a beautiful place. But above the doorway are three large words, etched in marble, quality, opportunity, and justice. And those three words animate me as Attorney General, animate our office and its mission. And that's something that PAD has been really working hard to live up to and to fulfill. And I've been so pleased with what we've seen over these last 100 days.
Michelle Kallen (13:03):
That's great. So in terms of PAD, you mentioned issues involving electricity and affordability, and Virginia has been really at the center of the data center boom in this country. Is issues related to data centers and electricity issues, that's within PAD as well?
AG Jay Jones (13:18):
Yes. In Virginia, we are no strangers to data centers. We are ground zero for the industry. We have over 400 operating data centers here in Virginia. Most of them concentrated in Northern Virginia. I think there are about 117 that are in construction or in the pipeline. It's certainly something that has provided a lot of revenue to our localities here in the Commonwealth, but we are also sensitive to the fact that folks' energy bills are going up, costs continue to rise, and there are ongoing debates in our legislature about how to deal with this issue and help offset people's rising costs while also being, I think, sensitive to the economic benefit that these data centers have provided to our Commonwealth. And so I'm going to be honest with you, this is one of those times when I don't miss being in the legislature. I will let them debate what the best path forward will be.
(14:09):
But whatever they ultimately conclude, should my office be involved in that, we will do it to the best of our ability. But we have an obligation to represent the consumer in front of the State Corporation Commission, and we will do that vigorously. I'm very proud of our new section, Chief John Farmer, who is another long-time veteran of this office who understands my goal, which is to give the consumer the best possible outcome. So we have given John and some others a lot of leeway to go and be creative about finding ways to not just represent the consumer well, but to work with the legislature to find some dynamic ways to help offset some of these costs. It's something that I became very fascinated by when I was a member of the legislature. Never in my wildest dreams would I have imagined eight years ago or nine years ago when I was running my first campaign that energy would be such a big flashpoint here in the Commonwealth.
(14:58):
But we are here now and we are all in it together. And so I applaud the General Assembly for coming together to try to find ways to put people first while also maintaining our, I'd say, dominant in that area and that space because it's certainly been beneficial to a lot of folks across the state.
Weisiyu Jiang (15:14):
And General, you mentioned the energy sector and the issue of affordability being one of your primary priorities. As utilities look to expand capacity, sometimes they do this through acquisition of power generation facilities. How is your office approaching antitrust and the consumer protection oversight in this space? What specific factors would lead you to step in to challenge such power generation facilities acquisitions? 
AG Jay Jones (15:39):
Yeah, and this is sort of the new frontier talking about antitrust, but then also marrying that with energy. And it's certainly a conversation that I continue to have with some of our regional colleagues here, Brian Schwalb in DC, Anthony Brown in Maryland, certainly Dave Sunday in Pennsylvania as we think about PJM and how that service is being provided to our states and where our utilities can source this energy from. And I think at the end of the day, everybody will agree we have a lot of energy demands and we have to find ways to meet that because if we don't, that cost is going to end up getting passed to the consumer. And so the thing that I've charged my utilities group with is finding ways to be creative to help alleviate those costs for consumers here in Virginia. And that's obviously going to have regional implications.
(16:20):
And so we are in a moment when I think we have to consider every possible avenue. And if antitrust is the avenue that's going to provide results, then we'll look at that and we'll have to pursue it. I think one of the things that is really helpful in these moments is cooperation amongst offices where we can leverage resources and assets. I will tell you that in Virginia, we are a creature of statute. I owe a lot of our headcount and a lot of our budget to the General Assembly. And so I have asked them for more people in this office to help meet some of the demands that we see across Virginia, whether it be dealing with issues from the federal government. We spent a lot of time litigating with the administration, but also finding ways to help at home here as well. So for those who are unfamiliar, Virginia, we have yet to come to an agreement on a budget.
(17:02):
I'm urging the leaders of the General Assembly to do so, not only because it helps me and my office provide some visibility into our fiscal standpoint, but allows us to plan and help organize the office in a way that we can orient it towards delivering on these results. And I would love to see us have a robust antitrust practice that is mentioned among the best in the country. But frankly, we have not had the opportunity to invest our headcount in that space at this moment, but I'm optimistic that we can make that change. But for now, I rely on folks like Phil Weiser on folks like Rob Bonta, on folks like Jonathan Skrmetti in Tennessee who care deeply about using this mechanism to help their constituents, but also help people across the country. And so we have bipartisan cooperation in this space a lot, which again, is something that I did not foresee, but I'm happy about.
(17:45):
And I think will continue to be a place where everyone across the country is leaning in, especially when you see every single state talking about the affordability crisis, talking about energy demands, and talking about how to best find ways to leverage their offices when the legislature is not acting or has not yet had a chance to act to provide some relief in the interim.
Michelle Kallen (18:04):
One area that we've seen quite a lot of bipartisan involvement and NAAGS involvement as well has been on the AI front. And so we'd love to hear your thoughts. How has the emergence of AI impacted your enforcement posture and how do you work with other states when it comes to issues involving artificial intelligence?
AG Jay Jones (18:24):
Well, let me take one step back and say that we are in the process of developing an AI policy for our office. And as it relates to how our attorneys and our staff will use AI, I think we can all agree that there are tremendous benefits to AI, but there are also a whole host of unknowns and potential risks with it as well. And so we want to be mindful, not just from our own standpoint, but how we deal with it. And we have had robust conversations with the legislature. They have some commissions and committees that meet off season, and I think we are in the process of developing our own state-specific AI framework. But this is a place where I've learned a lot from my colleagues about not only how to use AI to help advance our issues and our policies in our offices, but how to engage with entities that are using it with the ultimate priority of keeping people safe.
(19:11):
We had a landmark piece of legislation here in Virginia that was passed last year, and we are committed to enforcing, which is a ban on social media use by children for more than an hour a day. And frankly, one of the things that we have had to grapple with from an enforcement perspective is how AI plays into that as well. And so we are really at a place where everyone's minds are being stretched as we think about how we can keep this in front of us while also harnessing the benefits of it, but making sure that we're protecting our communities because we know that AI is being used in a whole host of ways, whether it be algorithms for pricing applications for a lease for a place to live. And how are we making sure that that is obviously being administered fairly and in compliance with the law, especially in situations where there is no law.
(19:54):
I think five years ago, six years ago, when I was a member of the legislature, if you had told me that this would be a problem at this moment, I'd say you're crazy, but I guess we've all seen Terminator 2, and we know that that is now closer to a reality in terms of AI being a part of our day-to-day lives than we ever could have imagined. So we're being thoughtful about it, we're being mindful, but I would be lying to you if I told you that it didn't come up in conversations at AG gatherings constantly because it's certainly something that every state is thinking through and thinking about. And so when the legislature here decides to act, we'll obviously be involved in that. We have a really robust policy and legislative operation here because a lot of times you'll see that folks in the legislature want to do something that implicates the AG's office.
(20:34):
And we say, "Yeah, we'd love to do it, but we need a little bit of money to do that. Or we're happy to do this, but let's think about it this way because you guys might be thinking about it one way, but we are thinking about it from a legal perspective."
Michelle Kallen (20:44):
Has there been coordinating across the different AGs in terms of how general consumer protection laws map onto current AI issues? That seems to be something that consumer protection overlaps various states, and it's an area that's in the heartland of what AGs do. So have you been coordinating with other states on how to map on general consumer protection laws onto new technologies like artificial intelligence?
AG Jay Jones (21:12):
We keep a close eye on our other states and what they're doing and if they've had successes or they have identified areas where there's places to improve. And my consumer chief, Richard Schweiker, has been here for 30 years. Actually, his anniversary was just the other week. And so I think he's one of the best in the business. And this is something that they have been really engaged in over the last few months in particular. And so we have really urged them to, one, get smart on this stuff and two, look to other places to see what's working, have conversations. The ability to reach out to other offices is amazing. We learn so much from our brother and sister states across the nation. And so part of the reason why I love consumer protection is because everything can be consumer protection if you think about it a certain way.
(21:53):
And so they really are, I think, crime fighters, if you will, try to help bring solutions to policy landscapes or regulatory schemes that don't necessarily have that built out yet. And I think that's an area where from a legislative perspective, we offer a lot of insight comments to the legislatures about what power our office should have to help enforce if there are wrongs that have been committed or being a watchdog to make sure that we are protecting people from these emerging threats using existing laws to try and be that sort of stop gap in this particular moment. But the technology is advancing quickly. I think if you legislate something today, we're going to be trying to solve for it again in a year or two just because of the rapid advancement that we're seeing. But it is becoming something that both the legal and non-legal side in our offices are keeping a really, really close eye
Weisiyu Jiang (22:36):
On. General, you mentioned using existing laws to address new issues arising from the use of AI. I'm wondering, in your opinion, are existing consumer protection laws and data privacy laws, including VCDPA, Virginia Customer Data Protection Act, do you think that's sufficient to address harms arising from the use of AI?
AG Jay Jones (22:55):
Well, obviously it'll be a case-by-case basis, but that's certainly what we have at our disposal at this particular moment. I think one of the things that I'm very interested in is updating our VCDPA because it's got to meet the moment and meet the challenges of now. But I think that's a backstop for us to look at to try to help step in when we see some issues. I also think our Data Privacy Act, which I voted for six or seven years ago, was written and drafted in a moment when we had not contemplated that AI would be so prevalent. And so I think we need to take a really hard look at updating that. It's one of the places where I believe my office will have some off-season conversations with legislators about what changes can and should be made to update that to address some of these challenges that we are now seeing.
(23:38):
But one of the things that I learned from AG Racine when I was in DC is that any enterprising lawyer can find a way to figure it out and find something to use as a basis to go after somebody. And so I'm really proud of the team and the talent that we've assembled here in Virginia because I think that they're excellent lawyers, they're wonderful public servants, and they are just really, really smart people who are committed to this mission of protecting folks in Virginia and across the country. And so my hope is that we will continue to find ways to be involved and to be aggressive, but we don't hesitate to go talk to the legislators about giving us some additional authority. And as a former member of the legislature, I feel very comfortable that a lot of my former colleagues are attuned to our needs here in this office as well because it's a win-win.
(24:19):
And frankly, now more than ever, Attorneys General have become the place where all the action is happening. Washington seems to be at a perpetual standstill. We have the ability to move and to move quickly, whether to go into court, to engage with our communities directly. The list goes on and on. And so I think now people have figured out that these positions really do have a broad scope and a purview that is almost immeasurable. And in these moments when you're looking for quick action and decisive action, it's AGs who are able to stand and deliver. And that's something that I think is really exciting to be a part of in this moment.
Michelle Kallen (24:54):
How do you navigate? I mean, in this era where you've got the current dynamic at the federal government, you also have more of a deregulatory effort, especially when it comes to issues like artificial intelligence. And you have proclamations from federal agencies saying, "This is a federal issue and we prefer deregulation here." How do you approach those federalism questions? And you can talk about it in the framing of AI because that's kind of been a hotspot, but those issues of preemption and federalism seem to be really at the forefront of our national conversation on new technologies. How do you go about thinking through those sorts of issues?
AG Jay Jones (25:28):
Well, first, let me say this. I want to dispel this notion that there are states out here like Virginia that are fundamentally opposed to the administration and the things that they're doing, and that's not true. If they are doing something that is in the best interest of Virginia, we are a ready and willing partner. But right now in this moment, there does seem to be a lot of conflict between the federal government and states. And sometimes it's Republican states with the Republican administration. Sometimes it's Democratic states with the Republican administration, but we all have our ideas and interpretations of federalism and what is the purview of the federal government versus what is left to the states. And I think this is one of those moments where we're seeing a massive churn as to what was understood to be a state specific thing versus a federal issue.
(26:11):
And again, we'll just go back to Live Nation. The DOJ settled that case, but the state said, no, we're going to continue on and carry forward. And so for me, it's always about prioritizing Virginians. And so if it's going to be in their best interest and the federal government is not acting, we will act. It's really as simple as that. But I look to some of my colleagues who have been aggressive and been creative about how to try to find ways to work with the federal government to find solutions. I think one of the things that has been most encouraging is that a lot of people in this space are problem solvers and they're looking for ways to be creative and to be willing partners. And I think that's a really important thing to do. And so there's a push and pull and I think that's natural, but I think as we see areas that have yet to be touched or have yet to be regulated by the federal government, then obviously we have no choice but to step in.
(27:01):
We think about areas like cryptocurrency, you think about areas like AI where the federal government will debate it and they'll talk about it and they'll have some sort of legislation that may be introduced. But when you don't have some of these frameworks and these schemes, you're left with ages to step in to the void or state legislatures to step into the void. And frankly, I think there has been this idea for a long time that states are the laboratory for ideas to be creative and to try things out. And now more than ever, it seems as if that is the case. And so I watch my legislature, they're across the street right now meeting in their reconvene session and the ideas that they're kicking around and what they are doing in response to an absence of federal action or what our fellow states are doing, North Carolina, Maryland, our neighbors here in the Atlantic.
(27:47):
So it's one of those things that I don't know if there's a right answer or a good answer, but we certainly are attuned to the absence of action, which is not the same as inaction, but that can change on a dime. And so we've just got to be as ready and able and willing to respond as possible.
Weisiyu Jiang (28:04):
General, with respect to consumer protection, because I understand that's one of your core priorities, we've seen that states have been increasingly active in regulating online marketplaces, particularly around consumer protections and platform accountability. And for large e-commerce platforms operating across multiple states, what types of practices are more likely to draw attention from your office?
AG Jay Jones (28:26):
I think in today's world where everybody is participating in the online e-commerce world, you are always on the lookout for fraud and scammers. And one of the things that I have really been focused on is that as it relates to our vulnerable populations, and in particular, the elderly. Again, we all get these phone calls saying we need money or refinance this loan. But people are getting texts, they're getting emails saying, "Hey, this transaction didn't go through. You need to reenter your card information." It's really creative. We're always sort of playing whack-a-mole, it seems like, with new things that are coming up. But certainly those fraud and scam situations, and that's something that we've talked about as a big group of AGs as well, because this is obviously impacting states everywhere and it's interstate commerce. And so we had National Consumer Protection Week a few weeks ago, and one of the things that we did was highlight for Virginians what to be on the lookout for as it relates to scams and fraud and how to protect themselves.
(29:23):
Don't give out your personal information. Don't send things out over an email or a text if you are not certain who you're talking to. Be mindful of phishing. And just sort of the basic stuff because I will admit life moves really quickly and we're all doing stuff on our phone as we're walking or running somewhere or we're eating and we're really susceptible to overlooking something. And so my advice obviously to people is to be diligent and to be mindful. And if you have any issues, to call our office. And I'm really happy to say that people did heed our calls and participate. And so we did see an uptick in complaints and in contact from other communities across the Commonwealth, which is great. But certainly that really is at the forefront of focus And you take that with the access that children have to technology and to these e-commerce platforms and to places, these social media sites that also double as e-commerce platforms.
(30:11):
And so we obviously are really mindful and that sort of plays into the social media ban that we pass here in Virginia that we are seeking to enforce. It's currently under litigation. But I believe deeply that that law, which was passed with bipartisan support signed by a Republican governor, will have real benefits for kids across this Commonwealth. And so that's why we remain committed to protecting them from scammers, from abuse, from predators and the like.
Michelle Kallen (30:33):
A number of our clients are in the technology space who are looking to comply and enter markets or offer products in a way that respects state laws and aligns with AG priorities, but especially if it's an area where there isn't on-point legislation or on-point regulation. Do you have any advice for companies in that situation who are looking to enter the market or participate in the market in Virginia in a responsible way in areas where there isn't clear regulation for them to look to, to really understand whether their products are compliant?
AG Jay Jones (31:07):
Yeah. Obviously being mindful of the laws that are on the books is a basic and fundamental tenant. We would encourage every person and every entity to comply with that. But in Virginia, we have attorney general opinions, which I think is a real place to find some clarity in the absence of laws at the state level or to find that sort of midpoint when you have a federal regulation that may or may not be on point versus a state regulation or a state law. We churn those out pretty regularly, which I think really does help us state our policies, but also provide guidance without having to rely necessarily on the legislature. I can't speak to other states and how they work, but that's certainly something that we have as a tool here in Virginia to give guidance and advice when asked in the proper way. And it really does, I think, have benefits for folks who are, I don't want to say confused, but are trying to navigate very complex landscape and are very mindful of trying to be a good actor.
(32:00):
And I think that's the one thing that we're always looking for are people who comply with the law. I think there's clearly obviously uncertainty in a lot of different spaces and places. And so we as an office, 600+ of us, try to provide as much insight as we possibly can while being really mindful of what we are allowed to do and what we can do. So it doesn't hurt to ask questions and it doesn't hurt to contact our offices. I think there are a lot of folks who believe that AG offices are scary places, that we're always going after bad people. We're also here to help. We are a resource and our office has both legal and non-legal employees who do work all across Virginia, whether it be community outreach, our programs division, or the lawyers. And so we are here as a resource and I want people to be mindful of that.
(32:45):
And so my hope is that the people who are listening to this will use our office as a place to be more informed. And if we can't give you the answer you're looking for, we can at least point you in the right direction before something else happens or something bad happens.
Weisiyu Jiang (32:58):
General, some of our clients are international companies. So they are headquartered outside of United States, but they do serve US consumers online. Are there particular compliance expectations or risk areas that you think are not always well understood by non-US companies?
AG Jay Jones (33:15):
If there's one particular place that I think is probably susceptible to confusion and to, I'd say an area of concern is the transaction payment processing space and being sure that you're compliant with what is required and expected under both federal and state law. That stuff can be very tricky. And that's just me personally speaking about that. But I think clients who are coming from an international place and space, being in close contact with our state corporation commission, with the folks who are really sort of enmeshed in that is really, really important. And Virginia, we always like to say our lights are on. Our doors are open. We want your business. And that's true. And we've been really proud to be a top state for business in the rankings on an annual basis. And so I like to think that our environment and our atmosphere is open and welcoming to all comers, and we want businesses to thrive and to be successful.
(34:07):
And so if there are compliance questions, reach out to our office, reach out to the SEC. We're again, here to help. I want people to sort of dispel this notion of government being scary, of government being inaccessible. My pledge last year during the campaign was that I wanted to return this office to the people. And I think we've been able to be successful in that, but that also means that we are availing ourselves of anybody who has issues or who has questions that we're not closed off, that we're not siloed off, and that we are really a place where you can come and get answers. Or if you can't get an answer, we're going to point you in the right direction so that you get an answer so that you can have that success here and get that outcome that you're looking for.
Michelle Kallen (34:42):
So as we come up on our time here, looking ahead, you're looking back on almost 100 days in office. Looking ahead, where are your priorities shifting to? Have you kind of changed perspective in terms of where your priorities were when you came in almost 100 days ago and now looking forward?
AG Jay Jones (35:00):
Well, it's been a heck of a hundred days, but we, again, remain committed to protecting and defending Virginia from overreach by the federal government. We want to make sure we are being dynamic listeners to people across Virginia and knowing that their challenges are our challenges too right now. Obviously it's lowering costs or finding ways to make life more affordable and then keeping communities safe. So those three things will not change, but we are certainly excited about the work that we've been able to do to get the landmark vape law passed in the legislature so that we can enforce laws to prevent underage vaping here in Virginia, to be able to work with the legislature to enforce this social media ban. The list goes on and on, but all of it really does fall into consumer protection and keeping our community safe. We'll continue to do that.
(35:42):
But one of the things that I've charged my team with being mindful of is that we want to be dynamic and reflexive and responsive. And that's something that I think we really are committed to so that we can continue to provide the best services to our people across Virginia because that's what they deserve.
Weisiyu Jiang (35:57):
General, for the next several years, what are the policy areas where business should expect the most active enforcement or litigation from your office? It's
AG Jay Jones (36:04):
A good question. I think antitrust is a place where we are using that lens to try to examine ways to bring costs down for people, trying to make sure that everybody gets a fair shake. But again, for us, that all kind of falls under consumer protection. So our public advocacy division will be a place to keep an eye on. We've got some rock stars there. I'm proud of those attorneys. I'm proud of the work that they're doing. And so we'll continue to highlight and leverage them, especially as things continue to move forward.
Michelle Kallen (36:28):
So general, is there anything we haven't covered that you would like to share to close us out?
AG Jay Jones (36:33):
No, I think we covered a lot. I really appreciate the chance to spend some time with you all and talk about the wins that our office has achieved and our vision and our perspective on things. I am sure that we will do this again sometime soon. And part two will be just as riveting and thrilling, and we can talk about the new emerging issues because we know that what is important today may get solved and there's an issue that we haven't even thought about that six months from now will be dominating the conversation. So I appreciate the chance to talk with you this afternoon, and I look forward to doing it again sometime soon.
Michelle Kallen (37:02):
We would love that. It was wonderful having you on, general. Thanks for joining us.
AG Jay Jones (37:05):
Thank you very much.
Weisiyu Jiang (37:06):
Thank you, general.
Voiceover (37:08):
Thanks for listening to On The AGenda from Steptoe. Subscribe in your favorite podcast app so you don't miss future episodes. To learn more about Steptoe, visit steptoe.com. When the stakes are high, experience matters.






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